chris on Wed, 29th Jul 2009 5:00 pm 

Wow what unprofessional behaviour on the owners part! It reminds me of the saying ‘Money doesn’t buy you class’. I am disappointed from a South African racing fan’s viewpoint that this star horse will no longer be trained and ridden by our very own International champion trainer/jockey combination. My thoughts are with Mike de Kock and Kevin Shea, remember one thing guys: The Wheel Turns! Roll on Muisir, Our Giant, Lizzards Desire. Meydan 2010 here we come!

ANDREW BON on Wed, 29th Jul 2009 8:49 pm 

WHY DOES THIS NOT SURPRISE ME !!!!!!!!!!

T.R Middleton on Wed, 29th Jul 2009 10:45 pm 

Richard Hannon trains in Wiltshire which is 150+ miles from Newmarket !

charl on Thu, 30th Jul 2009 6:03 am 

thank you for that correction.

Kathy Immelman on Thu, 30th Jul 2009 9:11 am 

Mike de Kock did make it clear that this run was experimental, to see if JJ would get the extra distance. If Ms Boyens didn’t like the result that’s tough, that’s racing. Presumably she agreed to it beforehand, or if she didn’t then the other owners outvoted her.

Grow up! Trainers are very busy people, they haven’t time to dance around socialising with every owner, and most owners (I hope!) have the nous to realise it. I go out with a doctor, and no ways do I expect to bother him during consulting hours with anything less than life or death matters. I would get a short sharp answer if I tried!

The irony is that JJ is (i.m.h.o.) coming up to winning something big - it’s just taken a couple of months longer than we all hoped. Now Richard Hannon will get the credit, and all Mike de Kock’s work will be forgotton. Like with Rachel Alexander - y’all will know the story re her first trainer.

JJ Fan on Thu, 30th Jul 2009 1:30 pm 

R Middleton - whats your point????

Have you seen Hannon’s set up -

“We have a seven-furlong polytrack, and the one-mile McArdle all-weather, which has a surface not dissimilar to polytrack, is relatively new, having replaced the woodchip the season before last. We did not get much change out of £400,000, but it has already paid for itself, with two Group 1 winners having been prepared on that gallop, in Indian Ink and Paco Boy.”

chris on Thu, 30th Jul 2009 3:29 pm 

I don’t get what the distance from Wilshire to Newmarket or Hannon’s polytrack has do with JJ The Jet Plane? I agree with you Kathy, trainers have much more important things on their minds pre-race than keeping part owners happy.

KG on Thu, 30th Jul 2009 4:35 pm 

Well without part owners you dont get to have anything to keep you busy .Dont forget the customer who pays your bills.

Charl on Thu, 30th Jul 2009 8:31 pm 

Mr Middleton merely pointed out a mistake contained in original copy, since corrected.

Dazza on Thu, 30th Jul 2009 8:53 pm 

Very harsh on Mike de kock and his team , who have done very with this horse.

As the saying goes ” If you want loyalty , buy a dog” !

Charl on Thu, 30th Jul 2009 9:02 pm 

May I point out again like in the forum.. whoever the horse, owner or trainer… if there is unhappiness in the camp, or personality clashes as its been called, the horse is affected. Unhappy owners must move, it is not a moral or ethical issue, nobody owes nobody anything, it is simply a question of harmony for the horse.

Any trainer/owner will tell you once there is unhappiness among partners, it’s best to break up and go different ways.

Johnny Murtagh said in an interview with this site… “the horse takes on the personality of the trainer..” Similarly, horses can sense disharmony and it affects their racetrack performance.

nicky on Fri, 31st Jul 2009 8:18 am 

mdk needs such a arrogant part owner to grow up and never allow her near his yard besides she does not even own a horse of her own

Mitch on Fri, 31st Jul 2009 11:24 am 

It’s very obvious that it’s a matter of ’sour grapes’ or ‘bad looser’. People like Thea Boyens should not own horses or for that matter own SHARES in racehorses.

lucky houdalakis on Fri, 31st Jul 2009 1:48 pm 

I see a couple of people here have a lot to say about miss booyens,who i might add has class and doesnt need to buy it,have any of you bothered to find out her side of the story,im sure we all know the saying its your side my side and the truth.

lucky houdalakis on Fri, 31st Jul 2009 1:52 pm 

Oh nearly forgot,why only lambaste her when theres 4 owners of the horse.Perhaps if need be i can give you her address or phone number and perhaps you can pay her a visit or call her and explain to her how she should go about matters.

lucky houdalakis on Fri, 31st Jul 2009 7:05 pm 

ihad fo join to get my 20c worth and no responce/wow the greek is dissapointed come all you laptoppers surely you have a response talk to me poleeeeeeaaase

charles on Fri, 31st Jul 2009 8:08 pm 

Lucky - you are spot on, don’t waste your time with poeple playing “devils advocate”.

All the best with JJ, well done on keeping your dignity in all this, leave the keyboard warriors to their childish games

Dazza on Fri, 31st Jul 2009 9:03 pm 

Lucky , as one of the owners , could you tell the public the truth why the horse was moved?

charles on Fri, 31st Jul 2009 10:52 pm 

According to the article Published by charl on July 29, 2009

………circumstances border on the bizarre.

Hennie du Preez, speaking on behalf of JJ The Jet Plane’s owners, told racingweb: “Our reasons for moving from Mike de Kock are personal and have nothing to do with the performance of the horse. We’d like to leave it at that.”

MdK ““Thea Boyens’s behavior is juvenile”

The owners decide JJ is to move, nothing bizarre about that, but one owner gets singled out, is that right?

There are more holes in the above article than there are in Blackburn, Lancashire.

Sort it out Alec, you don’t need to stoop to this

lucky houdalakis on Sat, 1st Aug 2009 9:26 am 

Morning charles,im glad you agree with me about as you call them the laptop bandits.Exactly why i dont go on these forums anymore,cause i realized we have so much waisted talent in this country,we got the best trainers and jockeys but unfortunately they not out in the field,they hide behind there laptop with a funny pseudonim.Right the story goes like this,coenie called mdk and mdk told them the tickets where at the gate,they got the tickets and coenie phoned mdk to tell him they are there.Mdk apparently was having lunch and said he would see them soon,they walked around for about 45mins from room to room trying to find a place to sit,they eventually found a table.At 3.01pm i got an sms from coenie telling me how dissapointed they were about mdk’s attitude towards them,so thats an hour and a half before the horse even ran he was moving.First time they saw mdk was in the ring.So im sure if you guys at the top of this collum where in there shoes you to wouldnt be impressed.Now that is there side of the story and im sure mdk has his side.Mike called me the next morning to have full go at thea and i told him what i knew and told him to stop attacking her alone cause she never made the decission alone,the only thing she did wrong was have the guts to aproach him and tell him how they felt.This the reason why i feel so strong about everyone having a go miss boyens.So there you have the juice from there side.So in closing i and im sure them still believe that mdk is a great trainer and this little hicup will have no impact on his success,maybe just his ego,we all know mal he gets if things go wrong.But as for me im still gonna go and take his cash at the golf course.Shew this was hard work.Im outa here and play nice now kids.

Charl on Sat, 1st Aug 2009 10:29 am 

Charles…

This story, on the day, 29 July, was reported as it stood at the time, speaking to Mdk, Coenie (refused to go on record), Lucky (refused to speak to me, never does), and Hennie, who made the comment as given. That was FOUR DAYS ago, and factual at the time.

The so-called “truth” - i.e Lucky’s version, which includes an sms from Coenie nobody knows about, has only now surfaced.
It includes, to my mind, more pettiness on behalf of the owners. They have raced in Dubai and England with Mike, they know their way around. Their lunch tickets were there, he was elsewhere engaged.

Should he have waited at the gate with a procession of trumpets when they walked in?

Lucky’s mail proves more pettiness on behalf of the owners, double-talk on behalf of Coenie who tells Mdk one thing and Lucky another.

The only “holes’ Charles, are the one in your head, and I shouldn’t be “stooping” even as low as to answer you, but anyway.

Lucky, you also know in your heart of hearts how owners behave, how they hold you over a barrel for every cent, how they think always you owe them a favour, how they exploit your training with veiled threats and consistent nonsense and talk behind your back. And how they themselves become ”trainers” who want to do things their way when they now zero.

Then there are a select few owners who pay their fees, trust their trainers and get aloing like a house on fire. They never seem to have any problems,they become stlwarts of the stable and friends.

That is why, Charles, you lay journalistic advisor, this whole situation was very correcty termed “BIZARRE”, for wont of an even stronger word. Lies, runarounds, refusals to comment and cowardice. Crawl back in your hole, dumbkopf!

lucky houdalakis on Sat, 1st Aug 2009 10:48 am 

Charl that is there version i wasnt there,this is there version and im sure when you speak to mike you will get his version.Then all this nonsence can get behind us and live happily ever after.These people who speak so bad about miss boyens imo are out of line.But im still gonna take that pigeons money at the golf course.

Steve Reid on Sat, 1st Aug 2009 10:51 am 

What a joke. I seem to recall a similar type article abusing the owners when the michelin man got his wires crossed about who was going to train the horse when he got to Dubai. Poor journalism and blind faith in one side of the story. No prizes for guessing whose side he listened too.

Lets ask the question about who owns the horse? If the owners want a certain jockey on their horse, I believe the trainer should accede to the request. Another question. The owners had flown eleven hours to get to the UK, then a number of hours on a train to get where they needed to be. Was it too much to ask for Mdk or one of his staff to at least meet and greet? No dutchman your head is firmly up where it usually is.

I know all four owners of JJ personally through my patronage of Lucky’s stable. I have been privileged enough to spend racing days with them. They are decent good people who have no airs and graces. If a trainer does not show common courtesy, I support their decision to take their business elsewhere.

My message to Andrew Bon, yourself and the rest of the knockers is simple. This has nothing to do with you. Mind your own business

South on Sat, 1st Aug 2009 12:55 pm 

What you all fail to see is that MDK has no respect for any person .Any person who calls his owners low life or white trash from the south deserves everything he gets .Should also not forget he is from South hills himself .

Steve Reid on Sat, 1st Aug 2009 12:57 pm 

he is from raceview alberton. i knew his late dad very well. went to school with his younger brother.

chris on Sat, 1st Aug 2009 1:27 pm 

And so the saga rolls on. As it rolls along gathering more moss, people get trapped in even deeper holes as they are caught out amongst a miriad of lies. The whole truth will never be revealed. It seems like the whole problem started with such a minor grievance and mothballed into what makes some fascinating reading. Thank you Charl for yet again setting the facts straight. This could all make for a best-selling novel titled: JJ The Jet Plane’s Overseas Escapade!!!

charles on Sat, 1st Aug 2009 7:41 pm 

Remember this thread on the forum of this website?

http://www.racingweb.co.za/livetalk/showthread.php?t=779

Charl posts “I dont think Oscar would want his movement of horses discussed on the forum, anyway it goes beyond your rumours to a more complicated affair Garth that is best not discussed here”

Spot on Charl, its his business and you were correct to point that out - perhaps you should try and maintain standards rather than double them?

Enough said

charl on Sat, 1st Aug 2009 8:01 pm 

JJ is an international boom horse, an SA representative overseas and the story was well worth telling.

Steve Reid on Sun, 2nd Aug 2009 8:17 am 

as long as it serves your purpose?

hypocrite

Steve Reid on Sun, 2nd Aug 2009 8:18 am 

international boom horse with “limitations”

go figure

JJ Fan on Sun, 2nd Aug 2009 4:37 pm 

Just a question to Kathy Immelman- how can you compare horse racing to your boyfriends surgery busines?

The last time I check I was lead to belive that horse racing was under the ENTERTAINMENT/GAMBLING umbrella???? So, why should a trainer or anyone from his yard not be “responsible” in entertaining the owners?? This is the reason why so many owners get sour to the sport so somewhere along the line the initial passion the had for the sport is somewhat drained by fees, vet accounts, more purchases, more vet accounts so when they have a horse running at the races and ACTUALLY make an effort to attend the race (many owners dont even attend races locally) nevermind to spend R50 000 a trip to watch their beloved horse race overseas surely it would not be too much to ask that the owners are treated with a little more than a sms on arrival.

If the trainer is not a social creature then maybe they should employ someone to do the spade work on theirs owners and keep them feeling somewhat special cos at the end of the day without the owners we have no horses and have no races! (well I guess that only pertains to some in the industry)

Deon Anthony on Tue, 25th Aug 2009 9:05 pm 

Hi all
I know that some trainers have a fall out with patrons or vise-verse some time or another, its just a pity that it had to happen between the connections while our champion sprinter is carrying the S.A. flag. All i can say is that i really hope the connections of the horse and our master trainer can put this behind them, U never know when u might need some 1 one day either to take a horse or send a horse overseas. Trainers need good owners support and remember that owners need good trainers to provide results. This whole episode is non of my business but if the vibe between the owner and trainer is not good then ask yourself this ( where is your luck ? )

Anton on Thu, 27th Aug 2009 7:50 am 

If I remember correctly MDK said Striker will NEVER ride for him again after they had a fallout about 18 months or so ago after striker said one of MDK horses maybe just wasn’t good enough. (cant remember the whole story.)

Did his personal issues come in the way of his professional responcibility?

Deon Anthony on Thu, 27th Aug 2009 3:23 pm 

I think that before you comment on personel issues or professional responsibility, should it be to your interest then you either need to remember the whole story or find out what the whole story was . Besides that its non of my business to know what the story was but I think that both the parties that you mentioned have moved on with things, bygons are bygons. Most trainers would like most of what the jockey you mentioned can offer and then again many jocks would give anything to ride for a yard like MDK. Take nothing away from either party ( they are both professionals in their fields )

Jonnyboet on Sun, 6th Sep 2009 1:41 pm 

Lucky’s version of events is gd 2 hear, Id not heard that side of the story. But if Cooenie was so p***ed of with MDK why was he drinking away the evening with him & his cronies later rather than being with the other owners? Anyway, JJ’s a good horse, if he’s going to suceed he’ll do it wherever he is in the UK. If he doesn’t then maybe his international career is not going to take off & he shud come bac to SA where he is a superstar.

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